Mating Grounds: Geoffrey Miller and Tucker Max Copy Danger & Play and Hilarity Ensues

A disgraced academic Geoffrey Miller has partnered with fratire author Tucker Max to create a men’s lifestyle magazine called Mating Grounds. I would wish them the best of luck with Mating Grounds if either of them had any integrity. But they are riding coat tails and pretending to be original when they are copying Danger & Play.

It’s quite cool to start a site to compete with Danger & Play. Say my site sucks. Say you can do it better. That’s fine. Besides, knowledge advances when someone comes in and makes old ideas better.

But to say you don’t know it exists is low-down behavior. To claim you’re original when you’re nothing more than a Louis Vuitton bag being sold out of the Garment District is disrespectful behavior that has to be called out.

Geoffrey Miller and Tucker Max claim that Mating Grounds was needed because, “[Tucker Max’s] writing is the only frank and honest thing they’ve ever read on sex and dating. There is nothing else that talks about these issues the way you do.”

Geoffrey Miller danced with the devil that is Danger & Play back in May, 2013.

(Geoffrey Miller likes Danger & Play’s tweets but claims he’s never heard of Danger & Play.)

Geoffrey Miller Danger and Play

Perhaps inspired by my brashness, Miller tweeted that fat people lack self-discipline:

geoffrey Miller

It was a stupid tweet. Some of the best lawyers and doctors and PhDs I know are obese. They like to eat and don’t care that they are fat. It’s perfectly possible to have the self-discipline to get a doctorate while munching on fettuccine alfredo.

He immediately pulled the tweet. He should have. He was wrong.

He should have said, “That was dumb. My bad,” and been done with it. Keep raising hell. Being dominant means being respectful and admitting when you say something stupid. No big deal. We all say and do stupid things. Own it and move on.

But Professor Miller did not own his words. He lied and said the Tweet was being used for “research purposes.” He was studying how people would react to trolls online, he said.

Eventually he had to fess up. No, he wasn’t doing research. He was just being an idiot. What happened next will be seen as ironic considering that Professor Miller is now writing about masculinity.

Professor Miller has tenure. This means he could not be fired for a silly Tweet. He had total job security. He could have just said, “I was an idiot. You’re overreacting. I’ve apologized and that’s it. I’m not going to grovel.”

What did he do?

He went into some Star Chamber and agreed to the following punishment:

The University of New Mexico has formally censured Associate Professor of Psychology Geoffrey Miller for misrepresenting to his department chair and colleagues the motivation for a tweet he published this past June.  The tweet, which questioned the willpower of overweight Ph.D. applicants to complete a dissertation, was widely disseminated. Miller quickly removed the tweet, posted an apology and then closed his Twitter account.

As part of the censure, Miller will be required to:

  • Work with the faculty co-advisors of the Psychology Department’s Diversity Organization to develop a plan for sensitivity training as it pertains to obesity.
  • Be assigned a faculty mentor [i.e., babysitter] for three years with whom he will meet on a regular basis to discuss potential problems.
  • Have his work monitored by the chair of the Psychology Department.

If you want advice on how to bow down, check out the Mating Grounds. I’m sure he has a lot to say about kissing butt and living on your knees rather than standing up like a man.

Presumably everything appearing on Mating Grounds will have to be cleared through the politically correct clearinghouse of academia. After all, Professor Miller must “have his work monitored by the chair of the Psychology Department.”

If you want authentic masculine self-improvement, stick around at Danger & Play.

We have podcasts covering game for introverts, posts and podcasts about money, and advice on how to be a more dominant man. We also write about game and how to have rough sex and testosterone replacement therapy.

Danger & Play is for men who want to go from average to alpha, not for middle-aged men who agree to go see a babysitter rather than stand up for themselves.

  • http://rivsdiary.wordpress.com/ rivelino

    “Being dominant means being respectful and admitting when you say something stupid. No big deal. We all say and do stupid things. Own it and move on.”

    good advice.

  • Dman

    I will be studiously avoiding this Johnny-come-lately. E-book on increasing testosterone? Come on.

    The reality is that most of the self-improvement content for men (sex, diet, test, money) is already out there; put out by this blog or in RVF or B&D or something else. Most “new” content from up and coming blogs now is at best a refinement of what’s out there, and at worst a mere paraphrasing (or hell even a copy as we have seen).

  • Simon

    I’m sure you had fun bashing those idiots, but why post about it and give them attention they don’t deserve?

    There’s too much good content here, someone had to copy it sooner or later.

    • Danger & Play Blog

      It’s public service. Men who turn to Google in the weeks and months ahead have the right to know the truth about these guys.

  • Simon

    And I like new comment section. Simpler to use.

    • Danger & Play Blog

      Thanks, I have been making a lot of incremental improvements over the past few weeks and have more in mind.

      Now I have to make sure the comments that got exported from WordPress to Disqus didn’t disappear in the Internet.

  • Peter Phoenix

    I wish them the best of luck. Building up a solid readership and some quality content takes years and I can’t imagine Tucker spending weekends at home working on his blog.

    Not only this, but they failed to innovate in their concept. He says that they’re going to do their own research but good research takes years and hundreds of samples. From this I expect him to find results that we’ve been talking about from experience for the last 2 years.

    • Danger & Play Blog

      They have a huge audience already. Sheep will love it over there. I don’t write for the sheep. But when truth seekers Google them (the only reason I posted this), they’ll find this post and won’t be deceived by liars and thieves.

  • Phero

    Its just part of the commercial bandwagon jumping on the manosphere.
    You could also say it was written 2 thousand years ago, but there is much to gain with sharing experiences in the form of a blog.

  • Telemachus_1

    I’m fairly well acquainted with Geoffrey, and this description is a bit incorrect.

    Of particular note, he has tenure at the University of New Mexico. He was teaching on contract at NYU, living in New York. Obviously, any sane man would rather be living there than not and Geoffrey was not different, thus attempting to appease the PC gods.

    Your defense of gluttons is a bit nauseated. Sure, it’s not a perfect correlation, but it’s really stupid to throw out personal anecdotes to someone who has done extraordinary amounts of social science research. No, your personal anecdotes mean nothing.

    I like this site. It has some fun content, but let’s get back to reality. Anyone who has read Geoffrey Miller’s work is well aware he is an excellent writer. Tucker Max, as well, as in fact quite brilliant and also a good writer. Both are orders of magnitude more intelligent than anyone who has posted on this site.

    • Danger & Play Blog

      Hi Tucker.

      • Telemachus_1

        You’re free to read through my comment history, and it couldn’t be more clear that we are not at all the same person.

        There is this phenomenon called the Dunning-Kruger Effect. It would seem to apply to you in this instance. Perhaps all those steroids you are using are making you manic?

        I really can’t imagine how a plebeian like yourself could possibly consider your own ability on par with that of Geoffrey Miller.

        • Danger & Play Blog

          You can claim I’m a poor writer or a plebeian or whatever. That’s fine. But you haven’t refuted a single point I made.

          Did Geoffrey Miller lie about his motivation for making that Tweet? Yes. Therefore he is a liar.

          Did he lie about not knowing about sites like Danger & Play? Yes. Therefor he is a liar.

          Did he bow down to feminists and agree to be babysat? Yes. Therefore he is a coward.

          Maybe Tucker will let you lick his butt hole in real life if you keep kissing his butt online.

          Good luck.

          • Telemachus_1

            I have refuted a point, and that is your allegation that obesity is not at all related to intelligence. It is a debatable topic, and the evidence is not anywhere near clear cut. Further, your employing of personal anecdotes simply shows you are completely unfamiliar with statistics and argumentation.

            As for lying about his motivation for making that tweet, the man is nearly 50. He wanted to keep his contract at NYU. At the time, it simply didn’t seem like a battle worth fighting. The only reason he was using twitter was on the advice of his publicist. He does have a third book in the works.

            I have no idea if he has heard of Danger & Play. I highly doubt he reads this site given he is a busy man, and really doesn’t give a shit about it. Why do you think he is partnering with Tucker Max? You certainly have provided no evidence to support your claim that he thinks about this site at all.

            As for his censure at UNM, he simply didn’t have a choice in the matter. The man has children. He has responsibilities. He isn’t sitting around jacking up steroids, wasting his free time gaining the body of a gorilla, and seducing borderline retarded women.

            Honestly, I like your writing. There is a place for you, especially amongst other commoners. But seriously – do not engage in the solipsism so often attributed to women. You are not at all in the same league as Geoffrey Miller. He does not write for you or members of your audience. You haven’t even read his moderately famous book, otherwise you reconsider your excessive infatuation with muscles and steroids. And I say this as someone who does work out and has even done a few cycles.

            You are coming across as an obviously weak and insecure man. Don’t be a fool.

          • Danger & Play Blog

            “I have no idea if he has heard of Danger & Play.”

            He followed me on Twitter and favorited three tweets of mine and had retweeted me.

            The evidence is laid out in the post, which clearly you didn’t read. If you question whether my screenshots are authentic then put your money where your mouth is.

            Let’s pick a neutral expert to audit my email account. Lay down $10,000, Mitt Romney (is he a plebeian, too?) style.

            If those screen caps aren’t legit, you win. If they are, I win.

            You down, beta boy, or are you going to keep running your mouth off?

          • Telemachus_1

            Obviously, I am recounting to you my personal conversations with the man, which I know to be true. I do think that is rather preposterous that you would believe that following you and retweeting your posts at all means he is anything more than casually aware of your existence.

            Regardless, I just don’t care. I certainly don’t care enough to gamble $10,000.

          • Danger & Play Blog

            Women don’t find cowardice attractive. You backed down like the little sexless dreg that you are.

            You’re a troll but you’re a funny one because this is what you really believe.

          • Telemachus_1

            I’m sorry, I’m continuing to engage you. Am I going to reveal my personal information to someone who is clearly less than sane and needlessly aggressive? No. People rely on me. Unlike you, I am a real leader and I have to choose my battles carefully and protect my identity.

            There is this guy. His name is Aristotle. He wrong about courage lies between cowardice and rashness. You should read it. Your excessive use of performance enhancing drugs has clouded your judgment on this matter. You are simply not worth the risk.

          • Danger & Play Blog

            Don’t reveal it to me. Let’s pick an attorney who will keep our IDs safe.

            You pick the lawyer. It obviously can’t be one you know due to conflict of interest laws.

            Just find one who is reputable.

            Then we have him dig through my Gmail. I have no problem handing over my passwords to the attorney of your choice.

            Or pick someone like Robin Hanson to facilitate it. I grew fond of betting after reading his blog so many years ago. Surely you trust him, yes?

            We can give him 20% of the purse as a fee. To me, that’s fine since it’s free money to me since I know what Geoffrey Miller did. I know he read my stuff and I know that once things got real after that fat tweet that he immediately unfollowed me.

            In the law you call that consciousness of guilt (by association). So Miller knows all about me and what I’m about.

            We can also put the $10,000 into a client escrow fund.

            Neither of us have to ever see one another.

            What’s it going to be?

          • anon1

            for anyone interested in the betting argument thing, http://www.overcomingbias.com/2013/07/bets-argue.html

            and some other cool supplementary info: http://adamgurri.com/?p=827

          • Danger & Play Blog

            Yep. The inside joke that my haters (especially the ones who claim to be smarter than I am) don’t get is that I’m a nerd.

            I had to learn game exactly because I was a nerd who would be far more likely to be reading Overcoming Bias (or Geoffrey Miller’s work, and I actually read the original scientific papers rather than the airport books) than some PUA site.

            And if they were really as smart as they claimed (they are not), they’d be able to see that someone who is able to distill complex endocrinological concepts into my TRT posts has a few horsepower under the skull.

            But they aren’t as smart as they think, which is amply demonstrated whenever I let their comments appear here and then humiliate them.

            It’s fun for the regulars to see me beat these guys up.

            Also, it’s important to remind guys (especially thieves) that despite D&P’s change in tone, that nothing has changed around me.

            I can write in whatever style I chose, but underneath it all is still a guy swinging a war hammer.

        • Brononymous

          Ah, the hoary old ‘Dunning-Kruger Effect’, the most arrogant and narcissistic of accusations to throw about in open debate, as accusers never once consider the possibility it might also be equally-applicable for explaining their own behaviour, and, as such, it’s a favourite – if tedious – argument of the mundane 110 to 125 set.

          Whilst I’m aware I’m a highly-intelligent man, I’m also aware that there are others far more intelligent than me, which keeps me humble and from falling into the intellectual trap of thinking I know everything and can no longer learn from others. The difference between you and I is that I implicitly-trust in my own ability to differentiate. Put Dunning-Kruger back in the box, before you risk embarrassing yourself further.

  • Telemachus_1

    “The information and advice they offer will be unlike any other resource available on the subject; it will be grounded in the most recent breakthroughs in evolutionary psychology, human sexuality, behavior genetics, and animal communication, presented through the lens of personal experience and actionable tips.”

    Yeah, that doesn’t sound like this site. At all.

    The very few articles that have been posted are not at all indicative of what is planned, and it’s foolish to assume that they are. Especially when the introduction tells you so!

    • Danger & Play Blog

      Sure thing buddy. I guess you don’t get the “inside joke” about why I use animals and gorilla avatars in my sex posts:

      http://s6889.p20.sites.pressdns.com/2014/02/11/fifty-shades-of-grey-sex-asserting-ownership/

      Or how I connect size with status in the animal kingdom.

      http://s6889.p20.sites.pressdns.com/2013/12/23/from-fit-to-big/

      Go play with your little boyfriends. You can’t hang with the big boys here.

      • Telemachus_1

        I’m really trying to spare you here, but since you don’t seem remotely conciliatory – I’ll just go all out.

        Had you read _The Mating Mind_, you would understand that mating criteria for humans is vastly different from all other species. You overestimate the value of apparent health as well as animalistic barbarism, and underestimate the value of intelligence and creativity. Your advice does not have any relevance to a man with a PhD. You have never been with a truly stunning woman who simply would never be remotely attracted to your boorishness. It would be plainly obvious to any such woman that you are a commoner.

        Do you understand why Mozart wrote serenades? Do you understand Lord Byron’s _Don Juan_? No? Do you cringe when you hear the word Romance? Yes? Well, all of these are indicative of your plebian taste. You are of slave stock, and in a more civilized age you would simply be tilling the field for your lord grumbling endlessly about how unfair your predicament is.

        Your continued existence is in reality a historical accident, purely due to the advanced technology invented by men very much unlike you and what you advocate.

        You don’t understand the word “alpha”. Are you going to lead any people to a great victory? Have you brought any beauty to this world? Do you even understand for a moment the Faustian nature of the European man?

        You should be living in Africa with your fellow gorillas and their kin.

        • Danger & Play Blog

          I have read Spent and The Mating Mind. They were fine books and deserved their spot on the airport book shelf next to Malcolm Gladwell.

          Anyhow, you’re a coward who won’t take my bet. You don’t have anything to offer here because you won’t stand by your word. (No wonder you and Geoffrey Miller get along so well!)

          Go troll elsewhere, loser.

          • Telemachus_1

            Are you black?

          • Danger & Play Blog

            Is that your way of asking to see my BBC?

            I know who you are in real life now. This is funny. You’re not trolling at all, this really is who you are.

            Go back to your neoreactionary blogs, son.

          • Telemachus_1

            No, I’m simply attempting to understand how you aren’t able to grasp the primary thesis of _The Mating Mind_ that you claim to have read. The thesis is simple: that intelligence evolved as a display of mating fitness, and creative arts in particular are humans’ display similar to horns on an elk, or the peacock’s feathers.

            But, it’s clear respectful debate is out of the question.

          • Danger & Play Blog

            Lookie here, my ape mind was able to get the highest class grade in four different law school classes. This is a screen cap of the place where the awards are kept. If you doubt my claims, again, pony up 10 G’s and we’ll have the lawyer of your choice (or Robin Hanson) verify them.

            In one of these classes I beat out the student who would go on to get a call from a Texas Supreme Court Justice congratulating him for receiving the highest score on the Texas Bar Exam. So this wasn’t the Special Olympics or anything like that.

            I’m bigger than you, can out argue you, can kick your ass in a fight, have been with more (and hotter) chicks, and I’m smarter than you.

            Keep failing at life and talking about the need for monarchy. I’ll keep killing the game

            Peace out, homie.

            – Mike (the black guy)

          • Telemachus_1

            It obviously takes a fair amount of intelligence to put together this site. I don’t doubt that you are more than capable in many pursuits. You advocate many things that are positive, and many articles here are quite good. Why do you think I read your site? It’s obviously not to troll you. There is value in much of what is published here, even if I find your sexual inclinations and tastes barbaric.

            All of that said, you really don’t know anything about me. You are certainly being irrationally self-confident regarding your superiority, especially the arguing. It’s not like you have anywhere near sufficient evidence to make such claims, and you are really far too defensive about my supposed questioning of the veracity of your words, which I really am not doing. I have no doubt that you are above average in most respects, and I don’t doubt Geoffrey Miller’s use of twitter. I do not believe it means what you think it means.

            However, I continue to submit that you are making a mistake by taking this route. From a practical perspective, we do share a common enemy and should be natural allies. Attacking Geoffrey Miller, Tucker Max, and now me simply seems like a waste.

          • Danger & Play Blog

            1. If you listened to my podcasts, you would have heard a reference to replica watches and costly signaling, an example taken directly from Geoffrey Miller’s “Spent.”

            “Spent” and “The Mating Mind” are not challenging reads. They are at Malcolm Gladwell level and suitable for for anyone with an IQ over 105.

            2. I was a fan of Miller’s (Tucker Max’s writing never appealed to me) until he decided to play a status game. In fact, I had a great amount of respect for the man.

            3. He and Tucker sought to elevate their status by claiming no one has written honestly about dating. This was a lie.

            4. Had Miller been honest, even giving a one liner about how the other sites were good but he could do it better, I never would have written this post.

            This post is caustic and mean-spirtied. In fact, I almost didn’t publish this post out of the regard I had for Miller and also because he and I share mutual acquaintances and friends. This post was honestly the hardest one I’ve ever published.

            However I am tired of idea thieves.

            5. I don’t care about forming alliances. If you actually read Danger & Play and aren’t lying, then you’d know I’m a warrior and not a politician.

            6. You can’t debate for shit. I have kicked your ass up and down this thread.

            7. I do know who you are. We have a mutual friend (a PhD from Stanford, if that’s a sufficient clue).

            8. As you know (if you’re playing chess like I am rather than checkers), I am not actually responding to you but rather putting on a show for my regular readers.

            9. Bye.

          • Telemachus_1

            While I would have preferred there were no veiled threats or personal insults, I will say that this is otherwise reasonable.

          • krauserpua

            He’s full gamma. Completely over-estimates the social value of intelligence, while also over-estimating his own intelligence. He’s desperately patching up his “I’m better than you” reality despite the overwhelming evidence he’s a loser both in life and in this debate, and he’s unable to realise how he looks to everyone else reading this blog.

            Note his effeminate debating style and quick run to the Code Orange shaming language accusing you of being a threat despite you never having made any even vaguely threatening comments (per this link, note to Tucker – this is a good one to rip-off http://exposingfeminism.wordpress.com/shaming-tactics/ )

            Classic gamma. Definitely not fucking hot girls or friends with high value men.

  • TRR

    My guess? Tucker Max’s new site is simply an easy way to make more money off fans of his books. The content will be extremely basic “eat paleo” “assert yourself with women” “do cross fit,” and be on par with your standard issue of Men’s Health magazine.

    Tucker’s recent twitter convos are all about building hype (telling people your upcoming site isn’t original isn’t exactly a good marketing strategy).

    He’s already spent the last few years trying to become more MSM friendly by stepping away from fratire, running a non-offensive type blog, getting away from hooking up, deleting offensive type tweets, so why would he swing back in the direction he’s worked so hard to move away from? It doesn’t make sense.

    • Danger & Play Blog

      Yep. He’s riding a hype train and I intend to derail it, because he’s an idea thief.

      He could have said my site sucked and I’d have been cool. People disagree about such things. Whatever.

      Joe Rogan calls out joke thieves and I don’t see the difference here. I’ll call out idea thieves.

    • http://therationalmale.com/ Rollo Tomassi

      Blue pill backsliding and publicly renouncing the paper-Alpha frat boy revenue model that brought you recognition can get expensive when you “accidentally” knock a girl up and need to rationalize reasons for marrying her. What’s an ‘entrepreneur’ like Tucker to do when he’s done a 180 on every premise of ‘Beer in Hell’ and detonated the only machine that might pay for his kid’s daycare payments?

      Reinvent a more commercially ‘palatable’ and feminine-primary revenue model by systematically mining the manosphere for the most provocative and salient issues its writers were raked over the coals to establish over the past 10 years. Then paraphrase and sanitize them to appeal to the sensibilities of a feminine-primary readership, and finally, repackage them as your own original ideas from a “former red pill guy who finally saw the light that ‘Not All Women are Like That’ and those dudes are just bitter-burned® incels who can’t get laid.”

      It’s a really brilliant marketing strategy that I’m sure Tucker will congratulate himself over; the only problem is that Rick Raw, Mark Manson, Athol Kay and Susan Walsh have already been using this ‘false-flag red pill’ revenue model successfully for over 4 years now.

      In fact I predicted this model coming about 3 years ago:
      http://therationalmale.com/2011/11/08/could-a-man-have-written-this/
      http://therationalmale.com/2012/12/28/sanitizing-the-imperative/

      My guess is the royalty money is drying up and Tucker needs to return to the publicity well once again, only he shot the golden goose in his pregnant GF / ONEitis fueled recanting of his former Alpha cad ways and needs to find some new way to reestablish his credibility.

      • redpillspeeddate

        I met Tucker and his GF at SXSW and his behavior was exactly what you are saying here. He wasn’t the center of attention he always claims, he just sat back and never stopped touching or preening the girl, she did all the talking for him. I didn’t know who he was until after he left and I was totally shocked that it was him. I can see this mating grounds being exactly what you guys are calling out, a way for him to make some cash before the baby shows up in August.

  • Jose L Romero

    This is a case of a person taking credit for someone’s else work! It’s just wrong!

  • http://www.wellbuiltstyle.com/ WellBuiltStyle

    Glad you went with the Disqus commenting platform.

    Solid move.

    Manny

    • Danger & Play Blog

      Thanks. I should have done it sooner and think everyone should be on Disqus.

      Getting my thousands of comments to import has been a challenge.

  • Mark

    Did either of these two or Mating Grounds take your copyrighted material? If so, you would have grounds for a civil suit.
    The professor probably gave in to avoid being suspended, or worse. But yes, he’s an idiot.

  • Brononymous

    “The thesis is simple: that intelligence evolved as a display of mating fitness, and creative arts in particular are humans’ display similar to horns on an elk, or the peacock’s feathers.”

    I haven’t read the book, but judging by your summation, the idea has to be more complex than that because it borders on what I would consider trying to sell a Hatefact to a Beta audience, the concept that women are actually attracted to intelligence, not physicality and dominance, which simply doesn’t play out, again and again, in everything I’ve observed about human sexual interaction. This is like telling a woman men are interested in her career and accomplishments, not beauty.

    My belief would be that women who claim to be seeking ‘intelligence’ are simply
    using that label to reduce the uncomfortable cognitive-dissonance of what they’re
    actually after: a man who possesses resources, either wealth, or an increase in her social standing via association, and, given the choice between two men with equal resources, would chose the more physically-muscular and dominant one.

    This idea presumes that every act of creation is intended for the social approval of or consideration by the public sphere, whereas I know various highly-introverted people who are consumed by their need to create, whilst being utterly-unconcerned about critical approval, because they know there is no-one intelligent enough in the public sphere to be capable of constructively-criticizing what they’re attempting particularly as the university-educated intelligentsia of modern society seems to be degrading down to mundane thought level of the 110 IQ variety, and perhaps even less. Sometimes the act of creation is simply intellectual stimulation or the longing for
    something of more value. Or was Emily Dickinson writing her poetry in seclusion to get laid?

    The people who do create for social approval usually have little to offer artistically. They simply want attention, so either dumb down their ideas or become agent provocateurs, neither of which hold much of interest or value for me.

    I’d recommend you do some reading into the psychological concept of The
    Communication Gulf. At +3 Standard Deviations, (145), any woman under 130 is going to have trouble comprehending abstract concepts I bring up in conversation.
    Under 115, any concept that strikes her as rational and logical will sound like mental retardation due to the horsepower capability of my mind. From her point of view, if I express my rational ideas in my natural vocabulary, what she hears will sound like pure insanity, because she can’t even conceive of the abstract thought processes my mind instantly grasps. To put it into context: 30 IQ points it the difference between average and what is considered ‘retarded’ thought. This is the reality of how intelligence communicates, and I always keep this thought in the back of my head: no matter how intelligent I think I am, I sound retarded to someone else.

    Learning this young, I learnt to hide any evidence of higher thought from women, and
    focus on physicality. If I talk to them as I would man-to-man, their eyes glaze over.
    Women don’t want and never will want me for my mind: they want me for the sheer size of the body I’ve sculpted, my ‘bad boy’ vibes and the fact that I’m dominant as hell, knowing that if she feels threatened, she pulls in closer to my body and feels safe because she knows any threats are scared of me.

    Even beautiful and intelligent women simply seem more interested in a man’s capability to destruct rather than create – the exception being it plays into
    her own ego and solipsism. A beautiful woman might like a song I write, but I guarantee she’d love it a lot more if she thought she was the inspiration for it. Other women similarly might like it thinking they might be beautiful enough to similarly function as a muse.

    But why expend that effort, when I can have the same effect on her by simply letting
    her feel my biceps around her slender shoulders and feel owned and safe? This is why my various creative pursuits of truth and beauty are for me alone. I exercise my body and mind, but I damn know for sure it’s the body that gets the women.

    I learnt this from my mentor, a guy who has been clocked at 159 and has a body of a UFC Fighter, and I’ve never seen without a beautiful woman on his army .

    My previous handle was AnonymousBosch.

    • Danger & Play Blog

      Any man with a truly elite IQ knows what you have said is true.

      That’s how you can tell that all of these guys are fakers.

      • Brononymous

        I had no idea who Tucker Max even was, and judging by his online biography and writing, I don’t expect to ever cross paths with his work again. The stories are gonzo journalism, functioning to sell ‘Tucker Max The Brand’ as a male aspirational figure, and any ideas about him delivering frankness and honesty in dating seems a stretch.

        Mating grounds is simple Brand Expansion, the Male equivalent of an Eat Pray Love Cookbook, or a pop singer’s new perfume line. Congratulations on him for successfully identifying and tapping a market – I can’t hate on a man for having the drive to succeed – but it’s a falsehood to say this information doesn’t already exist online, even in the diluted GQ / Men’s Health / Men’s Fitness form.

        You’ve built a high quality site, and I see no threat from them. ‘Going from fit to big(ish)’ is utter truth that all men need to experience for themselves to understand how women really respond to size, despite what they claim they prefer.

  • Gurney Halleck

    I read quite a few manosphere blogs, though I never visited this particular site before (looks nice.) I’ve read “The Mating Mind” and “Spent” and adored both, meaning that his twitter flap notwithstanding, I’m a fan of Geoffrey Miller.

    I don’t get what the exact beef is here between Danger & Play and the Geoffrey Miller/Tucker Max duo.

    Unless there’s more to this that you haven’t mentioned in the post, all I got was this:

    -Geoffrey Miller/Tucker Max announce manosphere-esque magazine.
    -Geoffrey Miller once followed the tweets of Danger & Play and favorited a few of them.
    -Therefore, this necessitates fear that this duo will ride the coattails of Red Pill bloggers and will compete against Danger & Play. What assholes.

    Is there more to it than this?

    • Danger & Play Blog

      Your reading comprehension skills aren’t at a high enough for read Danger & Play.

      See yourself to door.

      • Gurney Halleck

        Yea, Miller said this: ” “[Tucker Max’s] writing is the only frank and honest thing they’ve ever read on sex and dating. There is nothing else that talks about these issues the way you do.”

        I mean come on, what do you expect him to say? “I want to start a manosphere blog but let me first give props and traffic to all these other blogs that have been in the game for years.”

        • Jack

          No, he doesn’t have to give props, he could easily just leave that part out altogether. There is no reason to fucking lie.

          Regardless, Mating Grounds is going to suck, it will be essentially be Men’sHealth magazine, just with more “science”.

          • Danger & Play Blog

            These idiots/supporters of Geoffrey Miller can’t even follow a simple argument.

            First he said, “They didn’t do anything wrong!”

            Then he said, “Oh, well maybe he did do something shady, but what did you expect!?”

            It is true that I expect nothing but fraud and lies and deceit from Geoffrey Miller. After all, Geoffrey Miller got caught lying to his colleagues and supervisor and got censored for it.

            That doesn’t mean we can’t call out fraudsters. If anything it means we should remind people that Geoffrey Miller is not to be trusted and that his blog posts are likely dishonest.

  • Gurney Halleck

    I’m confused by the title. “Mating Grounds: Geoffrey Miller and Tucker Max Copy Danger & Play and Hilarity Ensues.”

    Two-statements, neither of which are true. Have they really copied Danger & Play?

    Where is the hilarity?

  • Gurney Halleck

    I should say though that Tucker Max always rubbed me the wrong way, his material mainly consisting of “I’m winning lollloll.” If there’s anything to say about the Miller/Max partnership it’s that it’s downright bizarre.

  • anon1

    hey man did you see this? Frost put up a link exposing yet another leech stealing your content. this time its ‘viva la manosphere’ and your fitjuice work http://www.thumotic.com/viva-la-manosphere-fraud

    • Danger & Play Blog

      I did. That is one reason I didn’t let this thievery slide by without commentary.

  • Rick Derris

    Unfortunately F*cker will do well in this endeavor. He already has a lot of idiot fans who believe his BS stories as gospel truth. He will also tap Tim Fraudriss’ army of nerdlings and Google-bombers in India to direct a ton of traffic to his new site (SEO “experts” are nothing more than creeps who hire a bunch of keyboard Morlocks). These guys are scumbags and it’s sad that they’re going to ruin this fun corner of the internet.

    • Danger & Play Blog

      I thought that, too, but the site sucks. Tucker keeps saying, “Geoffrey and I know what we are talking about. Trust us.” That’s the #1 rule violation as a writer. You’re supposed to show, not tell. Tucker and Geoffrey are both clueless, and it shows.

      They thought it would be easy to write about dating and relationships, but it’s actually really hard. And they’ve entered a space that has been producing quality information for years.

      They even closed comments after my friend Simon laughed at them for copying Danger & Play.

      That’s how fragile they are. One critical comment and they shut down comments sitewide. (They weren’t getting many comments anyway. I counted 4 for their entire crappy site.)

  • Dman

    Roosh is discovering all this right now, unfortunately.

    • Danger & Play Blog

      All prophets are called crazy at first.

  • GeorgeKaplan7

    What if I told you…the podcasts and advice are free?

    • Danger & Play Blog

      What if I told you the podcasts and advice are bad copycats and hence it’s the most poorly-received website and podcast in its genre? Don’t believe me. The 25 one-star and 29 two-star reviews speak for themselves!

  • GeorgeKaplan7

    The podcasts, advice and e-book on his site…they’re all free

    • Danger & Play Blog

      And it’s all trash. It’s Cosmo for Men. No one even cares about his site. I never should have linked to it, as the market has rejected it. Go to Google Trends. No one cares about Mating Grounds or Tucker Max. The only way they will sell books is by using shell buyers and other marketing tactics. Tucker the fraud failed yet again.

      • GeorgeKaplan7

        Cosmo for men? I’m not sure – Tucker and company have yet to touch on “75 Sex positions that will make your women squeal” or other nonsense like that. Every subject or claim in the podcasts so far has strong backing from research in social psyc, not just anecdotal BS. Cosmo also gets political, which this podcast does not. I did take a look at Google Trend, and yes, the search “Tucker Max” is pretty much non-existent now. BUT ‘Mating Grounds” shows a very recent spike (higher than the “Tucker Max” peak in late 2009 according to the chart. Also, many people who have access to itunes just search podcasts there. Given that they’re categorized under “sexuality”, I think a lot of young dudes would find it pretty easily. Once they see he’s a former bestselling author, they’re also likely to look those book up on amazon.

        • Danger & Play Blog

          The nice thing about Disqus is that it lets me see who is a shell commenter. This is your fourth comment. Three of those have been posted in this thread and the first one was a junk/throw away comment elsewhere.

          Hi, Tucker!

          • GeorgeKaplan7

            -Actually just signed up for Disqus, as well as the mating grounds podcasts so I went looking online to see what other sites had to say.

          • Danger & Play Blog

            Of course you did.

      • clickhere777

        So it took Tucker less than a year to get to where you were after like 2 and a half years?

        • Mike Cernovich

          Hi Tucker. You created a sock puppet to post this? Traffic must be bad.

          Your podcast has fewer ratings/reviews than mine, is poorly reviewed, and no one searches for your site.

          No one cares about you forthcoming book, either.

          Stop lying to your audience. You should tell your real story, about failure, bankrupting companies, having your dreams shattered.

          That’s real and raw and people would be interested in it.

          Good luck.

          • clickhere777

            Apparently they had over a million downloads by December. It can’t be THAT bad can it?

          • Mike Cernovich

            Even if you assume that’s true (why believe what he says), downloads can be purchased. “Mating Grounds” gets less than 1,000 search impressions per month. I see the back end for every search, as D&P is on Page 1. It’s been a failure.

            Again, tell the real story about big dreams being crushed and how you overcame it. That’s what people want these days.

          • clickhere777

            Ok. You obviously have been accumulating all this material – the website and shit tons of podcasts – did you ever think about publishing a book?

  • http://www.mymorningbacon.com Michael Hewitt

    Mating Grounds looks like it is directed at guys trying to get with women and that’s it. I think two things.
    1.) You are always more interesting and likely to attract women if you focus on “doing you” are hard and excellently as possible.
    2.) Why don’t people just make themselves as awesome as possible and let everything fall into place?

    Tucker could have interesting things to say, but it looks like he is playing to a Beta-level crowd who are not seeing the full picture of life and self-development.

    Who cares? More for the Alpha Wolves.